Hello all.
I'm a 20 yr. old American who has lived in NL with my Dutch partner since August 11th, 2008, but I had to return to America in November of 2008 because I couldnt stay with a permit. The IND told me I needed a work permit before I could get my residence permit, and I couldnt find work in time, so thats why I couldnt get it.
within the time i was in America, he came to visit me, btw.
Sooo....
I returned in March of 2009 with an au pair permit, and am allowed to stay until March of next year. That would be great, but I became pregnant(She was planned) with my partners child during my stay here now, and I am due in January, which leaves me with 2 months of being able to stay here after our daughters birth. We plan on getting married before the baby is here.

We need to know if anyone has been through the same exact situation, and what was done to make it work. We want to know ANYTHING really, that could possibly help us to be able to stay together.

Carinaaa ,

Sorry to hear about this difficult situation, but a big Congratulations of the expected arrival of little one !

We had friends in a similar situation, she had been living here with her Dutch partner for some years but her work permit came with a specialised job that wasn't permanent. they had a baby, got married and then second baby but when her job ran out she wasn't allowed to stay in Nl.. no residency permit.

She was forced to do a mass of paperwork , take her children and re apply from the South American country she was from , and she had to physically go there.. there were court things to tackle and it wasn't easy. They got there in the end though and she's now back here with everything sorted, but it was a year of hassle and paperwork and three months away from her hubby.

If you want I can try and find out more details for you.. maybe she knows of some shortcuts, but apparently it's like this now in ALL european Union countries... paperwork paperwork. You are basically applying to be a citizen and you have to go though all the due process like everyone else in the world who also wants to become a citizen in another country. Countries have gotten tougher much tougher...

I know it's NOT the news you will be wanting to hear and that with a new baby in tow things will be much more difficult, but a specilist laywer in this area might be a good place to start. I cam ask about that too, if you want me to.

I certainly wish you all the support and help you can get... but one very possitive note; your baby will become a very good reason for you to get though everything and will give you a lot of energy to do what it takes. She will change your life... ( you'll be tired to death in the first year but believe me it's ALL worth every second ... babies are amazing!)

Good luck ! ( hope that the pregnancy is going well too)

regards.. kiwi

"Local Heart, Global Soul"

Thanks for the reply ) Yeah that isnt the news I was hoping for lol. But is it not a bit different for your friend because she was from South America? Just wondering. I know it probably isnt much different, if at all.
We are trying to look into as much as possible right now before my time here is up, and I figured this would be the best place to look, besides talking to the IND ourselves. We do plan on doing that though.

Hmmm I don't know if there are different rules for different countries or not... ?

Certainly I would recommend that you do as much as possible now and soonest, not LEAST because you will have far less time and sleep after the baby arrives.

Also beaucracy being what it is, you can always count on having to do something unexpectedly extra somewhere along the line, form filling, documents translated, documents to a notary etc so give yourselves time to to the extra, so that as much is in order as soon as possible.. last minute actions can lead to stupid errors that in the worst case senario might cost you your case, so give yourself time to go over ALL the details, yes ?

Good Luck !

kind regards... kiwi

I am not saying this is you but many people become pregnant thinking this will improve their chances to obtain a permit. It obviously doesn't and it is the same in all countries. You must return to the country of origin and apply for the appropriate permit to benefit from a smooth and shorter process. If you decide to stick it out here and apply, it tends to be a harder process. Why? because most countries look at it as if you are forcing them to do something by being in their country and demanding to stay instead of asking them by requesting it from outside the country.

Why could you not stay as the partner of a Dutch resident? As long as he meets the requirements, income, single, etc. . . . you should be able to stay if you are a US citizen. Did the rules change on this one?

Well we were going to try this the first time around, but because I'm not 21 yet, they told us last minute (the day of our appt. at IND) that I needed a work permit first, before I could apply for the residency. Which is total bullshit in my opinion lol. Funny thing is, we even checked everything on the website and somehow never saw the "under 21-needs work permit" thing.
We are going to try to do the partnership reason again though. I really just want to avoid having to go back to the states and basically tearing our daughter away from my partner for months. And, though, I know those chances arent very high( without needing to leave at all), we just want to know what some possibilities are, and some advice that could possibly help...taking all we can get atm.

I understand. And I had no thought at all that this would HELP me be able to stay lol. In fact, the timing couldnt have been worse, and I think its making it more difficult. It's just kind of stressy for me right now. I guess I just need other opinions and all about this whole thing, and maybe someone can think of something that neither of us have yet.

Well I don't know where they came up with that one. It behooved your partner to call them on it.
They are concerned with age in the UK, due to human trafficking so I didn't think that regulation was an issue here at least not yet.

If you go to the immigrationboards.com
You will see lots of people (although UK based but some different european countries too) with the same scenario. The principles are all the same in terms of how the regulation is enforced. Check it out for yourself but how I summarized is how it works.
Unless you want to fight it out here and ready for a long haul and cost to pay an attorney, I don't see a benefit in sticking it out here except for your aupair status.
I do not know if you are allowed to convert it to pship visa at this stage so you will have to figure that out for yourself.

Unfortunately, the only way you can apply for a permit as the partner of a Dutch citizen (and soon-to-be parent of another Dutch citizen), if your partner does not satisfy the income requirement and if you are still under 21 (which means you can't ordinarily get a permit as the partner of a Dutch citizen anyways) is to basically throw yourselves at the feet of the IND and make an application based on article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights, the right to family life, which would in theory be violated if were to be deported from the Netherlands. Unfortunately, the IND is very unforgiving in granting permits based on this: they would basically say "nothing's standing in the way of the three of you being a family in the US, so we're not violating your human rights".

The bright side, however, is that you can buy yourself at least 2 years of time by appealing against the IND's rejection in court before you would really have to go, in other words you would be legally in the country until the last appeal was exhausted, so if it's really about just being able to be here and not being allowed to work (or have access to health care!) or anything like that then that is a valid option.

By the way, because you are a US citizen and are exempted from the MVV requirement (the requirement to apply for a preliminary residence permit from your home country), the fact that you are applying from the Netherlands for any kind of permit does not actually hurt your case. It's just a tough case any way you slice it, as I outlined above. Actually, even if you weren't a US citizen, you'd be exempted from the MVV requirement by virtue of the fact that you already have a residence permit. In the current system (this is going to change within about a year, when major changes are made to Dutch immigration legislation), there is no problem with converting any kind of residence permit to another as long as you qualify for the new one.

Your most practical option for really being able to stay and getting yourself some kind of real legal status sooner than later is if you and your partner get married and move to any other EU country, and if he finds himself a job there. Then you more or less instantly have a right to stay in that country as his spouse, and after a year or so the three of you can move back to the Netherlands and take those EU rights with you, whether he earns enough money in the Netherlands or not. This is typically called the "Belgium route" after the most popular destination for Dutch citizens and their partners for doing this.


Jeremy Bierbach, LLM
www.immigrate.nl

The problem isn't money, my partner has sufficient funds to support the both of us, as well as the baby when she is born and all. As far as I know, our only problem is getting a work permit, if it is true what the IND told us, which is that I needed one BEFORE I could get a residence permit, because I am not 21 yet.

We couldn't move to another country though, because my partner owns a business here, and wouldn't be able to move it away from here.

Thanks for the reply.

Quoted for the truth because I have that exact same letter.

How long until you turn 21? I'll be honest, I know it sounds difficult and hard, but the best option that comes to mind is to take an extended holiday back home and show off the new baby and just apply for a permit the day you turn 21.

I know you don't want to be away from your partner but look at the big picture. A few months away or 2 years of fighting the IND? I fought the IND for 2 years and it almost ruined my marriage

Sorry to go off on a tangent, but what changes are they planning do you know Mr Avocado?

Going through this thread, I don't understand... how is it that a female from Africa (Nigeria or Ghana I think) can be in this country illegally for so long? She got pregnant from a one night stand, the fathers around but only for the child and not together with the mother. The daughter is now about 6 years old I think and going to a Dutch school and the daughters legal status is recognised, thanks to the father she now has a Dutch passport but the mother hasn't done anything about her immigration status. I'm sure the authorities must know, she must be in the system somewhere, but do nothing. How is it after more than 6 years one can still be in this country illegally, yet others, who want to be with their partner legally, pregnant or otherwise, struggle?
I know of a few illegals here, I don't understand how they seem to get away with it so easily...

Honestly, any system can be worked. If you have contact with other illegals they'll tell you what you need to do in order to get around the system. On the other hand, if you are trying to do things legit and are part of a group without these contacts you won't have access to the information to work the system. I think this applies to any system, really. Many, many years ago in the states I needed medicaid, had no insurance, but didn't know the hoops I had to jump through in order to get it. I was denied because I had a place to stay (temporary but they still considered this friend my "support") I had been talking to someone while waiting and told him what happened. So he says, "No, this is what you need to do", gave me the steps to take. I did and it worked.

I'll be 21 in August. So its a bit far
You're right though, a few months away is much better than 2 years of IND bs.
It always looks so much easier, seeing as how many other kinds of immigrants are here and staying with no problems. :/

Yeah good question....lol

You may think that other immigrants have no problems but now is not the time to worry about what others go or don't go through.

Like I said, it almost ruined my marriage and we'd been together 5 years with a 4 year old son. Even though in my case, it was mostly IND incompetence, but why tempt fate in your case.

As someone wiser than me once said, "If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain or bitter, for always there will be greater and lesser persons than yourself."

So what exactly did you do that made a fight with IND? Stay overtime or?

Oh no, nothing like that. They lost the copy of my husband's contract that would have given me my permit. The agent handling my case was a first class tool and first told me that they had gotten everything we had sent them, then claimed he had never gotten it. And let's not talk about the note he put in my file stating that I didn't want to make a formal complaint, which is the page right before the formal complaint that is dated the same day as the note.

Yes, please elaborate.

You mentioned the baby was planned. I know love is strong, but why would you get pregnant with someones baby if you can't even stay in the country legally with them? Why consciously take the risk?

Also, you came here on an au pair visa. How did the family react when they found out your were pregnant???? It must be hard to fulfill your au pair duties and be pregnant.

What are your options right now. Do you have funds enough to support yourself in the US until this gets straightened out? Are your parents helping you, as you mentioned you are only 20.