As anyone else we are frequently using the VISa and Amstercard not as a credit means but more like a possibility to use PayPal, book the hotel, pay for a website etc
As our credit cards from banks overseas began to close expiration date we have tryed to get some VISA or Mastercard from our belgium banks...
To discover the unexpected but solid wall.

It seems like Belgian banks do not issue VISA and Mastercard check cards(they stuck with good-for-nothing Maestro system) which makes it not possible to use debt card for all international transactions where VISA or Mastercard is required.
They also are really paranoid about issuing credit cards, which requires procedure similar to moratgage request or 100K loan application in other places. Basicaly if one is self-employed or owns small bussiness chances are big that application will be turned down.

Not to talk about the obnoxious sytem when banks withdraw the complete credit card debt from ones amount every mounth.

I was wondering if anyone else were dealing with similar situation, and what options you can suggest. May be there are banks who are more cooperative in credit card situation or issue debet card with VISA (so far we have tried Dexia, ING and Fortis,) or there is a possibility to request credit card directly from the company?

Nick,

I suggest you buy something cheap you need ONLINE in the United States, for example at Amazon. Almost always they will offer you a VISA CREDITCARD together with your first purchase and a gift of 30$ on your next purchose. Of course nobody can force you to make another purchase t Amazon! I hope this strategem will work for you. It did for a few friends of mine.

nick, You can call your bank (US?) if your visa card is going to expire or has expired, and they will send you a new card with new expiration date here overseas. I know I have done this and had no problem getting it renewed. If you bank online, I'm sure you can also get addresses for stateside deposits for mail-in, etc. You're absolutely right, though, trying to work with the banks here or in the NL is virtually impossible.

AFAIR, his home state of Georgia has Tbilisi as its capital, not Atlanta

Whoa! Stupid me - I had no idea that it was THAT Georgia. On another note, did you move back from Mississippi? Last I knew, you were there and I just recently think I read that you were back overseas. I always enjoy reading your responses.

Yup!  And it's my son's fault.


We were expecting to stay in MS for 4 or 5 years, then - when we became 'retarded' - to move to 'Florder' for the winter and Europe for the summer.

Then I got a phone call, one Sunday morning in June last year ... "You're going to be a grand-dad."

That did it!  Manuelita decided that we really needed to be back in Europe, so we are.  (When she says 'Jump to it!' I say 'How high?')

I'm pleased to be back - particularly as (according to the locals) I'm 'living in paradise.'

Maybe.  If 'paradise' is 'Kevin Costner's "Waterworld" ' - With tourist prices  . (There isn't an emoticon for 'weeps insanely', so that will have to do.

I'm pleased to be back.  (No mosquitoes and no fire ants here.)

I can sympathise with Nick's problem with Credit Cards.  When you don't want one, your mailbox will be filled daily with offers from banks. - When you do, it will be filled with other kinds of Junk Mail.

Being 'self employed' seems to be the kiss of death when you apply for a credit card.

Credit cards aren't a lot of use in many parts of Europe (as much use as 'tits on a bull' in Germany) but you still have to have them - if only to pay for things outside the EU, or through merchants who prefer credit cards.

I've used PayPal frequently over the years.  It's really good for small payments, but if you make large payments (and they don't have to be that large - I paid somebody a little over €1000 recently) then the fee paid by the recipient can be extortionate.

If you're dealing outside the Eurozone, then you run into currency exchange costs (extortionate) and possibly Bank wire fees.

If you bank anywhere in Europe, then the country in which your bank is located will tell the country in which you are resident all about your account (they say it's to stop 'money laundering' - maybe, but it also stops tax evasion )

There's nothing to stop you from banking in a country which is not your own.

(Heads up, Nick - this might help):

You could, for instance, open an 'Offshore' account in the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man.  You could hold that account in Pounds Sterling, Euros and US Dollars.  (The bank will report all interest to your home state, so don't look on this as a means of fiddling taxes ... it won't work.)

Should you open Sterling and 'Currency' (USD & €) accounts, the bank may well give you Debit Cards in each currency.  (If you ask nicely.)  Those cards will act as Debit Cards in the UK (not sure why you would need a US Dollar debit card in the UK, but anyway).  They act as Credit Cards elsewhere. - As far as the Bank is concerned, they're Debit Cards - no money in the account, the payment won't be made - but as far as everybody else (the people you trade with) is concerned, they're Visa Cards.

(This next bit isn't intended as an advert or recommendation for any particular financial institution, but I'll have to 'name names'):

When I lived in Belgium, I banked with Fortis Bank.  I had an account with them in Euros, which also had sub-accounts in UK pounds and US dollars. - Very useful. - I could transfer funds into and out of my one bank acount in any of the 3 currencies, hold funds in those currencies and exchange them (at very favourable rates.)  I don't know whether Fortis offer this facility to all their customers, but it might be worth asking.

One other thing:

If you are going to have to move (largish) sums of money fom one currency to another, a bank may not be the most cost-effective way of doing so. - I've (recently) had to move a bit of money about and the exchange rates can vary quite dramatically.  Google 'Currency Exchange'... ('X' marks the spot .)  I exchanged $70k into € last week and saved myself about €1100 on the deal vis-a-vis the bank exchange rate.

Manuel, thanks for your "Haute Altitude" reply to Nick. I've learned a lot. You've been very helpful.

I didn't have too much difficulty getting a Visa card at Fortis. I just made an appointment with the lady who had opened my current account a couple of months previous, and she put the necessaries into the computer and I got my card about a week later. However, yes, it's one of those set-ups where the full balance is debited from my account the following month. The "flexible payment" option is available too, but I haven't applied for that yet because this arrangement keeps me from overspending ;-) Also, the credit limit is quite a bit lower than the Visa card I used to have back home, which can be a pain.

The thing that's most annoying, though, is that f-ing Ogone card-verification website that some vendors like Belgian rail use. Has anyone else had problems with it? I have had the site fail on me on more than one occasion when I was in the middle of a transaction. Another time, my card was continuously rejected for no apparent reason. I then switched to the Eurostar site and the payment went through. I don't know if it's a problem with Ogone (I suspect it is) or my card.

The thing that's most annoying, though, is that f-ing Ogone card-verification website that some vendors like Belgian rail use. Has anyone else had problems with it? I have had the site fail on me on more than one occasion when I was in the middle of a transaction. Another time, my card was continuously rejected for no apparent reason. I then switched to the Eurostar site and the payment went through. I don't know if it's a problem with Ogone (I suspect it is) or my card.
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Just a suggestion, but have you tried going to that site on a different Internet browser? I've found that work for me, with sites I'm having problems with!