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> Hilary
kevin1971
post Feb 26 2008, 04:50 PM
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I feel like Hillary is alienating me more and more.

I would have voted for her.

She keeps thinking attacking Obama will gain her mind or market share.

It's just not what America wants to hear. I think America is ready to do some listening for a change rather than dictating.

Every day she puts me more firmly in Obama's camp.
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K1
post Mar 1 2008, 06:00 PM
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Hillary is coming apart at the seams. She is making it look bad for any woman who may want to run for president in the future in the US. She is not keeping her dignity. She alienates her supporters each time she goes for too low a blow. She is finished already. Obama kept his dignity and kept it together the whole time,no matter what he was hit with. The guy has my vote and I am a republican. His dignity and integrity mean more to me than parties.Obama 08.
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sun-n-fun
post Mar 4 2008, 11:17 AM
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Hillary has gone to far in many ways.

Saying this prior to the start of voting on 4 March....

if Hillary gets the nomination instead of the rightful winner (Obama), then my vote will go to McCain.


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SunnyGal
post Mar 4 2008, 12:13 PM
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QUOTE (kevin1971 @ Feb 26 2008, 02:50 PM) *
I feel like Hillary is alienating me more and more.

I would have voted for her.

She keeps thinking attacking Obama will gain her mind or market share.

It's just not what America wants to hear. I think America is ready to do some listening for a change rather than dictating.

Every day she puts me more firmly in Obama's camp.


Welcome to our Camp!!! The more Hope the merrier! OBAMA-08!!! smile.gif


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utakubeta
post Mar 5 2008, 12:54 PM
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Please don't.
As bad as Hilary might be, it's nothing compared to the fucking evil under Mccain that'll happen.

It's like saying there's no difference between the parties, it's a k'nard.

There are vast differences!

Even Hilary, with all her corporate connections, is 10x better than the best the gop had (imho that was Romney).

Don't vote for the greater of two evils, please.

I'm supporting the Dem. nominee, even if it's Hilary. I'll hold my nose when I vote if I have to (as I did for gore in '00) but I'll still vote and support her if she's the nominee.

There's literally nothing she can do that will be as bad or worse than this fuck up *, or McCain, who'd be basically * II/III

it's a matter of priorities. Mine is to make the world better. That would happen MUCH slower under HRC... but it would happen.

under mccain, it would only get worse.

QUOTE (sun-n-fun @ Mar 4 2008, 10:17 AM) *
Hillary has gone to far in many ways.

Saying this prior to the start of voting on 4 March....

if Hillary gets the nomination instead of the rightful winner (Obama), then my vote will go to McCain.

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luiaarden
post Mar 5 2008, 05:15 PM
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I think it is great that Hillary is putting up such a fight. I see no reason why she should quit now (especially after hearing John Kerry on CNN last weekend). It is good for Barack to have to fight these allegations, ridiculous as they might sound, because there's worse waiting for him in the general election. We are finding out a lot about the electorate from this fight, and this is information we can use to win in November. At least I hope that Howard Dean is paying attention to the demographics.

In addition to the youth vote, we need to get the 51% of the population that did not vote last time (Bush got, what, 25% of the vote and Kerry got 24%). I think Barack might be better at this that Hillary because he is new and might be better able to reach them.

IzzieDee



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marthaa
post Mar 6 2008, 11:27 AM
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I have actually found that Hilary talks more about the issues than Obama..not sure where you guys are seeing all of this or is it just because you are looking for it? Of course, she is talking about weaknesses of Obama or any other opposition...watch for Obama to be doing the same in the coming weeks.



QUOTE (luiaarden @ Mar 5 2008, 03:15 PM) *
I think it is great that Hillary is putting up such a fight. I see no reason why she should quit now (especially after hearing John Kerry on CNN last weekend). It is good for Barack to have to fight these allegations, ridiculous as they might sound, because there's worse waiting for him in the general election. We are finding out a lot about the electorate from this fight, and this is information we can use to win in November. At least I hope that Howard Dean is paying attention to the demographics.

In addition to the youth vote, we need to get the 51% of the population that did not vote last time (Bush got, what, 25% of the vote and Kerry got 24%). I think Barack might be better at this that Hillary because he is new and might be better able to reach them.

IzzieDee

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sun-n-fun
post Mar 6 2008, 01:07 PM
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As was mentioned on ac360, Barack has shown he can take a punch. Now he has to show us that he can give one.

All well and good to be for change and above the fray. But when it is you and the other guy (Clinton, McCain or terrorist) you have to show that you can hang in there. And sometimes word just are not enough.

If he wants the job, he is going to have to fight for it.


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PanatellaFred
post Mar 6 2008, 03:09 PM
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QUOTE (sun-n-fun @ Mar 6 2008, 11:07 AM) *
All well and good to be for change and above the fray.
You write as if that's an easy thing to do. It isn't. In fact, no one has ever done it before. I think Obama should run his campaign the way his ethics dictate. To hell with the way things have been done in the past. The hell with "the way politics work". He's the agent of change. If Americans are too stupid to nominate Hillary (who could lose against McCain), then America doesn't deserve change. imo


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janet-california
post Mar 6 2008, 05:08 PM
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In the speeches I have heard, Hillary has ignited more of my interest. She makes specific references to REAL things in general. For example in one speech in El Paso she mentioned that she would like to raise the minimum wage to over 9$ per hour. And later in the same speech she said she would like to de-emphasize the standard exams and focus more on method of teaching in schools. Both issues are clearly in the realm of content and in both instances she makes a bold comment which speaks to the American who lives a life which is very different from the elitist armchair liberals who gravitate to the Obama camp. Yes Obama has a nice speaking voice and reminds us of other charismatic leaders, however, of the speeches I have heard I have not witnessed the level of involvement with the real dilemmas that people face on a day to day basis. His speech sounded more out of a movie than from a politician. This I believe is a style which has been working and indeed does draw many voters but for me I prefer a candidate which communicates the work of the politician (sometimes inspirational, sometimes just the nuts and bolts, but caring). Hillary is not perfect and as with others in Washington, she has to use the system in ways which are not always correct for every person involved. Obama does that too, even if he seems to be above it all. With Hillary I seem to pay attention to her speeches and become curious to her plans. With Obama I feel that he just keeps repeating the same things and sometimes makes odd statements such as "I know that the world is full of Muslims who before Al Quaida looked up to the America". This sounds quite arrogant. First not every Muslim, or any other person, "looks up" to the USA. People have always criticized the US and still will do so, and that is normal. Well I have my hopes on Hillary but if Obama wins then I hope he turns his rhetoric towards some real issues affecting domestic and foreign policy...otherwise McCain will gain the advantage.

Thanks for hearing me out.

Janet
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PanatellaFred
post Mar 10 2008, 12:53 AM
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If Hillary becomes president, won't it be weird for her to sit behind the desk in the Oval Office knowing what went on in that chair? Won't it be awkward for Bill to peek in every now and then and say Hi?


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PanatellaFred
post Mar 10 2008, 02:36 PM
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Hillary is a very intelligent, capable and accomplished woman. And she may sincere when she speaks about her altruistic motives for wanting to be President. But I don't think she is the strongest candidate against McCain. And this is what we need. McCain is telling you straight to your face, that "there will be more wars" if he is President.

There is more at stake than $9 hour minimum wage,etc. imo.. We need someone who can not only stop the tide, but turn it. To me it is clear that Obama is the strongest ideological candidate. True he doesn't spend much time manipulating the minutia, but we're in dire straits imo, and this is not the time to focus on the minutia. We need to get back Habeas Corpus, for instance. Put a leash on the dogs of war. Abolish torture etc. etc.


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"...it does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority to set bush fires in people's minds" - Samual Adams
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janet-california
post Mar 10 2008, 05:20 PM
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Well if you look through the material that is readily available on the internet, the ideology of the two candidates are similar in regards to escalating war and violations of human rights. Yes Hillary voted for the Iraq war but Obama voted to keep financing it. Both have said they regret their votes. In principle they want the same things, however, how each must attain them nobody can guess. I can imagine with every good intention there is a myriad of political obstacles along the way. In comparison, though, Hillary has a stronger contrast to McCain on domestic and economic issues and that is noteworthy. I still believe this gives her an advantage, and one that the average American can appreciate.

But if you look at how many democrats vote in comparison to Republicans in these primaries, it looks like McCain is in trouble no matter which one wins the nomination. Right now the party is polarized but after the nominee is chosen, the party should capitalize on this enthusiasm and take on the Republicans, full throttle.

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PanatellaFred
post Mar 12 2008, 05:31 PM
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Ferraro's comment was disappointing.


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"...it does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority to set bush fires in people's minds" - Samual Adams
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mr.fook
post Mar 12 2008, 05:39 PM
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QUOTE (PanatellaFred @ Mar 9 2008, 10:53 PM) *
If Hillary becomes president, won't it be weird for her to sit behind the desk in the Oval Office knowing what went on in that chair? Won't it be awkward for Bill to peek in every now and then and say Hi?


Yes indeed Fred , and what an ironic name you have...
have you got a -ahem - small 'cigar' ?
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The_Purple Cow
post Mar 17 2008, 07:54 PM
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Daily Kos has it about right, today.

"To reiterate, she cannot win without overturning the will of the national Democratic electorate and fomenting civil war, and she doesn't care."

**

Obama has won more states, more delegates, and the popular vote*.

If Clinton comes out of the convention with candidacy she will tear the Democratic party apart.

*why do people always say 'popular vote'? Is there such a thing as an unpopular vote?


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PanatellaFred
post Mar 24 2008, 05:35 PM
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.


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Spaatz
post Apr 4 2008, 07:41 PM
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Hillary will lose the Democratic Primary. There are no doubts about it.

Whether or not the damage she has done to her party by splitting the base in two by campaigning and supporting the mistakes of Florida and Michigan will destroy the hopes of Obama winning in 2008 is still to be determined.

Her slash and burn politics is not what the US needs. We need someone who can unite people. Not divide them.
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